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HOME • MANAGE SUBSCRIPTIONS • MEDIA KIT
Why Web Sites And Online Marketing Suck
by Joe Marchese, Tuesday, May 27, 2008, 1:30 PM

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TAGS:  Commentary, Metrics

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I have long been convinced that standard online marketing metrics were not only ineffective and inefficient for marketers, but were also destroying the quality of content on the Internet. Over a year ago I wrote about "Advertising's Role In Crippling The Internet As A Medium" and again in "The Online Advertising Conundrum - More Metrics, Less Meaning." The basic gist was this: because marketers were demanding metrics (i.e. impressions, clicks) that did not necessarily equate to value for a marketer, and could be faked or gamed, traditional media metrics were creating a lose-lose-lose eco-system on the Internet for publishers, advertisers and people.

I have never met Avinash Kaushik, Google's new Analytics Evangelist. But after reading "Google's 'Analytics Evangelist' Explains Why Websites 'Suck,'" an article by Mya Frazier about a talk Kaushik gave to a group of marketers, I think he and I would get along very well. From the article by Frazier: "Mr. Kaushik employed the word 'sucks' frequently when he talked about the traditional metrics used for measuring online marketing. And as far as online marketing goes, it sucks too. He likened it to a 'faith-based initiative.'"

One issue: placing all emphasis on reach over quality. How many BILLIONS of impressions is your campaign getting? If you are a publisher or ad network, you've heard it before; if you are a marketer, you're probably guilty of it. Are you going on faith that you are actually affecting consumer opinions of your brand with those impressions? Media buyers are forced to compare CPM or CPC costs, because that is the only common metric that they have to compare across online media buys. But what does the number of impressions generated have to do with value generated for a brand? Maybe something, maybe nothing. And we are back to marketers relying on faith. No wonder only CPA campaigns and other direct marketers are putting a significant percentage of dollars against online.

What should Web sites and ad networks be delivering to brand marketers? I would argue that there is a metric that could accurately measure online campaign effectiveness. This metric would measure the affect on brand awareness, brand perception and intent to purchase the campaign had on people exposed to various campaign assets. How? Ask the people exposed to the campaign. Sounds a lot like focus group testing, I know, but imagine focus group testing with scale and real-time results. It is not impossible, given the two-way nature of social media, that we could achieve a statistically significant sampling to measure the effectiveness of a particular campaign. Of course the Web site or the ad network couldn't provide this type of survey; it would require a third party that could compare the results across various online advertising methods to provide comparative results. Also, this method would presuppose people's willingness to engage with marketers, or finding the right motivations.

Metrics that matter are closer than you think. Imagine if Web sites didn't have to compete for "trick clicks" or massive impressions, but could report how effective their media was for marketers. They could focus on being more influential over their readers, meaning creating better quality. And marketers could focus on the number of people their campaigns actually affected. Imagine a new era in Internet advertising by applying methods marketers have been using for decades to social media.

1 person recommends this article. 

14 comments on "Why Web Sites And Online Marketing Suck"

  1. Varun Nayak from Socialesque
    commented on: October 15, 2008 at 3:03 AM
    Great writing Joe - we have developed technology essentially to change this. I encourage you to look at www.socialesque.com and let me know what you think.

    thx, Varun Nayak

    www.socialesque.com

  2. Bill Whetstone from TVisio.com
    commented on: October 14, 2008 at 3:05 PM
    The first shot across the bow was when Science trumped Faith and then the ascendancy of Marketing over Substance soon followed. Adam Smith had it nailed in Wealth Nations. What we need is an "invisible hand" not so much of government" but in the form of a subjective measurement like sincere inquiry. Metrics can never truly reflect the elusive human response factors. Face time stills rules.

  3. Joe Marchese from SocialVibe
    commented on: May 28, 2008 at 7:19 PM
    Stephan - I am really not sure how to respond. We might just have to, as Ron Burgundy would say, agree to disagree.

    I can't even count the number of conversations with industry insiders that have expressed frustration over the emphasis of impressions. We are an industry focused on reach over quality, because the only metrics we have are impressions, clicks and (maybe) acquisitions (if you even have a product that is sold online). All I am saying is that until we define new baselines, then publishers will deliver just what marketers ask for. If they are doing analysis of sales impact, they aren't doing it in a way that allows agencies to buy differently, or publishers to sell differently, so what the point?

    Deirdre – I agree totally. I think I could dedicate a whole post to innovative companies looking to provide a solution to this issue. One that you didn’t mention, that SocialVibe works with, is Marketing Evolution.

  4. Tom O'Brien from MotiveQuest LLC
    commented on: May 28, 2008 at 10:59 AM
    Hi Joe:

    I heard Avanish's talk last week and though incendiary, the big ideas are that measuring clicks is stupid. Most websites suck b/c of not enough experimentation and measurement. We have been using the wrong metrics for online marketing effectiveness. Online marketing has to have real world results (sales for example) or it isn't worth doing.

    @David - you get more of what you measure - and if your focus is on clicks you will get more clicks.

    @Keith - understanding the VOC is critical - and a huge shortcut to meaningful marketing communications

    @Kevin - measuring real change in Brand Advocacy may be the place to focus - we are doing lots of work on this right now.

  5. Stephan Pretorius from Acceleration
    commented on: May 28, 2008 at 4:58 AM
    Joe,

    I think you are oversimplifying and overstating the case when you say that "...marketers were demanding metrics (i.e. impressions, clicks) that did not necessarily equate to value for a marketer...".

    Regardless of the media pricing model used (CPM, CPC, CPA) I know of no serious online marketer who does not at least do detailed conversion tracking and analysis to see what the REAL impact of their media camapigns were on sales (or some other quantifiable result). How to measure and attribute better is currently the subject of a massive debate around engagement measurement and exposure to conversion analysis.

    This is definitely not an industry relying on impressions and clicks and emphasizing reach over quality!

  6. Drake Morton from Drake Morton And Associates
    commented on: May 28, 2008 at 12:01 AM
    What is it most marketers just "don't get" or is it "don't care"? This isn't brain surgery, this is common sense marketing!

    Are you advertising to people who actually care about what it is your selling, or are you turning back the miles on your odometer??

    Joe, well stated.

    Drake Morton Drake Morton and Associates, Inc. http://www.drakemorton.com

  7. Kevin Doohan from ConAgra Foods
    commented on: May 27, 2008 at 3:25 PM
    Right on Joe. I don't think there is much "trick clicking" going on these days, especially for large brand advertisers. My biggest passion right now is combining the quick, efficient, measurability of interactive (and I don't mean clicks only) with the decades of marketing expertise that our marketers possess.

    One of the things I understand Kaushik noted in the presentation is that websites suck in part because of hippo (highest paid person's opinion) input. I get that. I've seen that. But I've seen it less lately because hippos are "getting it" in greater numbers than ever and online veterans understand how to interact with the hippos to design interactions with the consumer at the center.

    Kaushik is "wicked smart" as we Red Sox fans like to say... but the whole hippo observation is kind of outdated.

  8. Paul Avila from Herbal Groups, Inc
    commented on: May 27, 2008 at 3:18 PM
    I fully agree that CPA is the way to go. After getting so much CPM uselessness it only makes sense to preserve ROI and go the CPA route. Advertising that sucks can be called "Publishers that suck." I have taken winning campaigns to multiple networks and watched as some succeeded and some failed. The failures try to blame the offer, wrong! It's the publisher - and I have proven it. Digital marketing is here to stay but the playing field needs to be leveled out. There are too many "players" taking money and failing in the interactive media space. I personally plan to direct our online dollars away from lower CTR banners and towards victorious email campaign. A billion ad impressions is useless to me - branding or otherwise. Plus it seems to me that branding products online results in zero sales yet everyone knows your name.

  9. Keith Grubb from Red River Advisors
    commented on: May 27, 2008 at 2:32 PM
    It is time to get answers and develop sound advertising campaigns with "Voice of the Customer" research and metrics before any campaign is launched. Build a campaign with consumer knowledge first. There are a few people doing great work in this area of VOC. If you know upfront what a consumer needs to know about a product and service and communicate this information the better the response. The research most companies claim to do upfront is tainted with results they self direct. Self fulling prophecy. I do believe most measurements currently are no more than a CYA exercise.

  10. David Musolf from Rebel Digital
    commented on: May 27, 2008 at 2:18 PM
    As someone who sells advertising on web sites, I disagree with the idea that it's the advertising that sucks. Some of it does, don't get me wrong, but for the most part, it's the metrics, analytics, ROI-enslavery and reverse evolution of advertising creative that really sucks. The original promise that online advertising was supposed to deliver (click-thrus = ROI = increased sales) is so 1996. However, 95% of all digital strategy at both the brand and agency level is wrapped up in this. Why? It's a impatient marketplace where people pay lip-service to new online advertising opportunities, but are wrapped up in the "ROI covers my ass mentality" that they've equated that with success.

    Sadly, this comes from the top down with most companies that are advertising on the web. Until a CMO gives the digital team enough latitude and longitude to plan and implement real advertising strategies that have a chance to succeed or fail beyond a DART reporting spreadsheet, then we're doomed to live with the failure of digital ROI. This, my friend, is certainly not new. It's "sucked" for years.

  11. Deirdre GaNun from MLB Advanced Media
    commented on: May 27, 2008 at 1:52 PM
    Joe:

    Your proposed solution to this metrics issue sounds alot like a Dynamic Logic or Insight Express brand study. These have been quite helpful to publishers and agencies in convincing marketers to attribute branding value to thier online campaigns, however when a site becomes overstaurated with surveys, it quickly reaches a point of diminishing returns and user frustration. Because no site can run a brand study for every campaign, they use case studies to convince advertisers to make a "faith-based" decision on the value of online marketing, but unless a brand has results specifically linked to thier campaign, they cannot assign the value on the back end.

    There is a great deal of duplication among the ad networks, portals and other mass reach solutions exisiting today. To some degree, a marketer needs to go on less tangible indicators of what they know about thier consumers. What are thier passion points, what trusted brands and sites do you want to align your message with to reach high gain consumers. There is a great deal of science and math we can use to determine effectiveness, but consumer insights can be hugely valuable in identifying what will have the most impact.

  12. James Glossinger from Morningcoach.com
    commented on: May 27, 2008 at 1:48 PM
    GREAT post! As I the founder of the internets largest real-time personal development community www.morningcoach.com. I would love to see metrics like this. Our traffic is so specific and we have people stay on our site on average over 8 minutes and they have trust in us.

    Being new to this and only having the site up for 6 months we have not established large traffic patterns and that has made it more difficult. I am looking forward to my first Adtech in Miami and hope to learn more! Great article I can only hope this time of metrics comes through.

    JB Glossinger Founder www.morningcoach.com

  13. Katie Paine from KDPaine & Partners
    commented on: May 27, 2008 at 1:47 PM
    Never mind that Avinash is one of the smartest guy in my industry, but he is so right. But the metrics (and bottom line benefits) go far beyond influence, they need to track improvents and/or declines in trust, credibility, customer satisfaction, commitment -- all the basic tenets of a good relationship.

  14. Roy Perry from Greater Media Philadelphia
    commented on: May 27, 2008 at 1:47 PM
    Wait till a campaign is over - see if anything happened. That's been the way of all advertising since the earth cooled but there's been a lot of noise that online advertising was better, even transformative, because through clever application of data you could control the outcome, even predict it in advance. The term ROI got worn out during these conversations under the curious assumption that a post-transaction variable like "return" was susceptible to being managed in advance, like pre-transaction variables -- cost, placement, creative, etc. Oh, well, nice try. If "It sucks" is the primary outcome, then maybe not. Or maybe not yet.

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JOE MARCHESE
  • Joe Marchese is President of socialvibe. Contact him here.


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